or whether sequestration and the fiscal cliff occurs. >> ifill: the across-the-board cuts. why does it work that way? >> in the event no deal is made and we do have the automatic cuts known as sequestration starting in january, federal employees face job loss and in some situations-- certainly in the department of defense-- but throughout the federal government people will be furloughed, forced to take unpaid days off, anywhere from 20 to 50 days. we really don't know. it depends in part on the agency and it depends in part on how much of the remainder of the fiscal year these cuts are squished into. so it's -- that's one bad situation. and then the so-called grand bargains and deals, many of those include provisions that would cut federal retirement benefits and extend the current pay freeze for an additional three years so that federal employees would go five full years without any paid a justments. >> ifill: hugh johnson, if you were an investor or a business owner and you're watching wall street watch the fiscal cliff debate what are you telling them? are people nervous